Warriors of Chaos, Feb 2nd

I feel like Fantasy is actually fairly balanced. There are good and bad matchups, but no one book really dominates.

Brian and I were talking about this a little at TSE today, my gut tells me WOC is going to be roughly in the same boat as VC or Empire with this release. There's a lot of goodies but no way to take everything you want at once, much like if you take a Mortis Engine you're not likely taking a Black Knight Bus, etc. I'm all for it personally, I like the idea of having more viable options over 1-2 lists that use different variations of the same units (Marauder Hordes for example).

One of the biggest deciding factors in my opinion though is how they handled Marks, that could be make or break for a few units.

I expect the marks to be the way they are in the Chaos codex for 40k. Chaos books for fantasy and 40k (Daemons, warriors, marines) have shared a bunch of common features the last couple of editions.

It'll be like any 8th ed release - the toys and the known power builds will be rendered obsolete overnight. Then the tinkering phase begins. In this phase we will see the monsterous cav options of the book stress tested.

Eventually someone will win a tourney or place highly with an interesting build and you'll see it copied.

Current prediction: Skullcrusher bus with the rumored hatred banner. One of the big master's complaints about Crushers and 'gryphs is that they can just whiff. And when that happens you're usually stuck in the wind. So if we get a Hatred banner - i'm running Crusherbus overnight.

Dragon Ogres will be made or broken on their T/AS. They can take being a 3+ or a 4+ at tough6, but at t5 it's going to make them seem a little weak unless they drop significantly down in points.

Other than that we'll have to stop relying on Gateway and Pandy to scare our opponents and play with the new spells. I'm personally hoping for more combat buffs/hexes so I when I commit to combat on turn 3 i'm not 5 dicing gateway at cannons and then just throwing Pandy up. I know only 2 magic items are rumored, but i'd love to see a Chaos Mutation/Gift chart that rivals the Vamps.

I want to play with the big stuff, see what happens to the shrines, and really play with the new magic. All in all, i'm stoked as a Warriors player and can't be more excited to break my army back out! (after I play with the Chaos Dwarfs for a while, of course )

I am with Capn on that. Most releases follow a standard chain of events. I also think Capn is right with the monsters. I am going to try running the new chaos monsters regardless of point cost and rules. I am starting to think that there may be a few good benefits to the monsters in this new edition as more armies get their 8th upgrade. I know the typical thought is that the monster gets shot down turn one, but only reliably against dwarfs and empire...I will take my chances.

The Skullcrushers VS Dragon Ogres debate keeps coming up, and I'm not sure I understand. I think of them both serving fairly different purposes, despite both being Monstrous Cav. My thought is that overall DOs will continue to sell, people will play with them a bit (hell people have been playing with them with their current stats and horrible models). I can't imagine them getting nerfed, it's not like they're OP right now, if anything they're a bit expensive compared to comparable options.

Skullcrushers I definitely don't see being changed dramatically from their current incarnation, though I'm positive there will be a few changes. HW by default with Ens and Lances as upgrade options.

I definitely would not mind seeing more parity between 40k and WFB in terms of things like Spawn for instance, I'm definitely excited.

The current problem with DOs is cost. When your basic core trooper is up in points cost it's hard to justify 65 points for a t4 4w 5+ save model.

195 for 3 naked or a Tzeentch warshine with points leftover?

Im also excited to get my chaos back on the table.

I think we are going to see point changes for most of the existing units like most of the 8th ed releases.

We have Slaanesh and Khorne cav units, I wonder if we get Tzeentch and Nurgle cav.

Chaos warriors on screamers or discs would be fun.

Word on the grapevine is that Nurgle is getting a fly mount for plaguebearers, if that's the case well probably see our own version around the time Daemons get theirs, you know they'll put it in the book and the won't figure out how to put Marauders on it for a few years then they'll release the models around the time the next book comes out.

Because I love you, and you feel me.

Removed pics, please don't hurt me...

Marauders are keeping the GW and Marks! But the cost has gone up considerably, with the current changes I see hordes really being out of the picture for WoC now. Though, at the new reduced cost and increased attacks Trolls might see more play, even in Horde formation (with Throgg).

It's more than slightly odd that Chimeras ended up being Special instead of Rare, Chariots in Core is interesting though.

245 gets me a flying 4+/5+ str6, 6 attack monster. I can have 3. This book is going to be epic.

Like I said at Shiloh, I've already got 2 chimeras to put together, I guess I'm getting a third for the monstrous horde. And yeah, time to plow ahead on the 24 trolls I've been working on. Chaos ogres will see some play, lost the chaos armor but gained impact hits.

Furthermore, I already see people restricting Daemon Princes and Chimeras for comp. Especially Swedish Comp, you know those bastards are going to hate double DP/triple Chimera.

Fixed

A little annoying that Blasted Standard and Banner of Rage are Tzeentch and Khorne only.

I'm pretty sure Will doesn't want links to scanned army books, especially if unreleased.

Just basing that off his reaction when that happened with Legion of Everblight's book.

Removed it.

Marks of Chaos stayed pretty much the same, Tzeentch however did get a nice casting bonus.
Sorcerers with the Mark of Tzeentch reroll 1s when channeling.

Eye of the Gods is a 2d6 chart now and the Champion can become a Daemon Prince.

Speaking of, DPs are badass now. I fully expect to see plenty of these hitting tables, especially since they can apparently use Magic items now...

(Time to put my two together and get them based/painted)

Chimeras have several options and are actually dirt cheap really, even after adding in options they're pretty decently priced. Also they're Special instead of Rare, so yeah 3 Chimeras comin at ya is a real possibility.

Magic is definitely going to be interesting, the added versatility from having an option other than those of their patron (MoT/Metal, MoN/Death, MoS/Shadow) is going to really be pretty awesome. I have to say though, I'd love to have Death or Shadow on a Disk of Tzeentch lol, but I'll take what I can get.

So much awesome, so little time...