My Game is Bigger Than Yours (Or How I learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Shooting Phase)

@jester to clarify, I meant that in the current environment I've been told people never disembark. They simply stay huddled in their vehicles throughout the game. But I've been out of 40k myself for nearly 15 years so all I have is here say. I'm definitely interested in getting into it as soon as new rules are released. But I may start collecting some chaos marines and imp guard soonish.

I tend to agree with bits and pieces of all the guys posting on here. While I think that both games are great, I tend to prefer fantasy to 40K in the current edition. There are some rules that I think need to be changed with both systems and that is just my opinion. I have never had GW call me up and ask me what they needed to fix even though I have called them several times to tell them.
I could easily go through and tell you what I like or don't like about each game, but it doesn't really matter. Different people like the games for different reasons. I once had a guy come in and tell me that he played 40K because he could honestly see that our world would end up eventually looking like a 40K game but certainly not like a fantasy game. To each their own. We could spend hours upon hours and several hundred pages explaining why I think this game is better or that game is better, but in the end, it is a personal decision and we have to pick what makes us most happy. Me personally, it is eating a bacon cheeseburger and drinking an ice cold coke while pushing around little plastic men.
If you come in to the store I will certainly have a spirited discussion as to why I like what I like, and I may even call you some silly name like Angry Shane or Tripple G but just know that it is all in fun and that I am just happy that you are playing the games that I love and helping to support my future retirement and the ability to sit on my front porch and yell at the neighborhood kids about walking on my grass.

ares wrote:

Me personally, it is eating a bacon cheeseburger and drinking an ice cold coke while pushing around little plastic men.

Quoted for truth.

Little plastic men are the optional part.

Dammit Brian, now I want a burger from Patricks. And I have to work today...

Grr ^_^

Seriously though, that does sound like a good time.

You're absolutely right though, that's exactly why I quit playing WOW - it stopped being a fun game and started being a job. When you forget the fun factor, you're missing the point of the game.

We all know why Jester jumped on the chance to have a game epeen thread: the guilt that eats at his soul and keeps him awake at night:

He knows he's playing the wrong game.

Actually I was really hoping for some full on nerd rage. Let me try a little harder.

Perhaps if I pointed out that you began in 40k but switched to fantasy when things locally got tough, ie the skill level rose, it might elicit a more vitriol fueled response? But I guess if the fire is hot, right?

Cheers!

I know. I should have just bought one of three competitive army books and brought my big stick.

You can't nerd rage me. I'm steadfast against 40k players.

capnwoodrow wrote:

I know. I should have just bought one of three competitive army books and brought my big stick.

You can't nerd rage me. I'm steadfast against 40k players.

Oh! Like chaos chosen war shrine combo? Or like outflanking dwarfs. Yep not at all the same. All the fantasy books are equal.



Come on. Give in to your feelings....

My point was 40k has 3 competitive armies. Your point is that there are cheesy combos in WFB?

You straw man so badly I'm going to find a tin man and lion to hang out with you.

You both suck because you don't play LOTR. And everyone eventually turns to Chaos; so meet you there.

I know. I want to be arguing about D&D

That tears it, I'm rolling

2 Shrines of Tzeentch
30 Chosen w Banner of Rage
5 Knights of Khorne
49 Marauders of Khorne w GW and BSB (Razor Standard)
20 Warriors of Tzeentch w Rapturous Standard
And a level 4 Tzeentch on Disk.

Fair and balanced game incoming!

Straw man? Cowardly lion? Are those some sort of chaos daemon? Must have missed them in my read through. Clearly underpowered since they aren't in my list.

Don't worry Cap'n when you realize things are unbalanced in fantasy too, there's always candy land. I hear the red yellow and green pieces were made with balance in mind. You have to ban the blue piece though. He's clearly broken.

As for Lotr. What is that? Is it even a game or is it a plastic recycling program gone awry?

I was more of a Shoots and Ladders man. After some heavy handed comping, it was Ladders in my house.

Hard to believe this all started because Capn wanted to take a jab a me. I do plan on playing 40k just as soon as the new ed comes out. Jester, I will take you up on the lessons.

It's all in good fun man

It only turns serious when it is dice down time. Then you Arse is mine.

You mean like when you lose the game on a random turn interval when you would have won without it? That's serious business.

/cough

And bad game design
/cough

Did you have the game if the turn didn't end? Not solidly. If you've won big it doesn't matter when the turn pops.

You had a weak win at best. If you table your opponent and break their spirit it doesn't matter.

Am i playing Nids, daemons, tau, sisters, chaos or orks? Have i had to advance under a torrent of shooting from one of the armies that can spam high strength shots? Has the table terrain been set up properly? Or am I playing gunline guard with a 18" x 18" open hole in the middle of the board?

Maybe a weak win was all I could get because of the natural inbalance in the game design towards one phase of the game.

Darkhorse wrote:

Hard to believe this all started because Capn wanted to take a jab a me. I do plan on playing 40k just as soon as the new ed comes out. Jester, I will take you up on the lessons.

Yeah, Jester and I really don't take plastic army men as SRS Business! We're just having some fun. I still plan on picking up 6th and the new CSM book when it drops.

We just to have to have some excitement!

capnwoodrow wrote:

Am i playing Nids, daemons, tau, sisters, chaos or orks? Have i had to advance under a torrent of shooting from one of the armies that can spam high strength shots? Has the table terrain been set up properly? Or am I playing gunline guard with a 18" x 18" open hole in the middle of the board?

Maybe a weak win was all I could get because of the natural inbalance in the game design towards one phase of the game.

Orks are now winning gts left and right. Orks are what you played. Just stating facts.

Now on to this D&D discussion. I have always preferred the old dragon lance saga system with no dice. Very cool setting but the system was the skunks rear end.

I like turtles.

Wildeyedjester wrote:

capnwoodrow wrote:

Am i playing Nids, daemons, tau, sisters, chaos or orks? Have i had to advance under a torrent of shooting from one of the armies that can spam high strength shots? Has the table terrain been set up properly? Or am I playing gunline guard with a 18" x 18" open hole in the middle of the board?

Maybe a weak win was all I could get because of the natural inbalance in the game design towards one phase of the game.

Orks are now winning gts left and right. Orks are what you played. Just stating facts.

Now on to this D&D discussion. I have always preferred the old dragon lance saga system with no dice. Very cool setting but the system was the skunks rear end.

That's true. They just won Broadside - a comped event.

Still don't see the other 5 up there. Or Eldar. 6. That is only less than half of current armies.

Bartholomew wrote:

I like turtles.

I like turtle soup!!! Yum and on another note, I hear that Lizard tastes just like chicken!!!

No, that was elves....

I won patriot last year with eldar and was 21 out of 160 with eldar at Wargamescon. Eldar was the most powerful army 6 years ago and chaos or orks was most powerful 5 years ago. Chaos will be on top again in 3 months most likely.

Would you say all armies in fantasy are equal and competitive? Would you say most armies are not better if the y have a more recent army book?

Pretty sure the strongest armies in Fantasy right now are Dwarves and Chaos Warriors, at least from what I've seen.

bsimon wrote:

Pretty sure the strongest armies in Fantasy right now are Dwarves and Chaos Warriors, at least from what I've seen.

Indeed and it wasn't too long ago that chaos Daemons and vamp counts were on top. To say both systems don't have less competitive armies is either folly or exemplary of a very short memory.

There was recently a 50 man GT with 2 eldar players total. Lots of blue, red, green, and space wolf grey Grey Knights tho .

I'd say the change to 8th made 13 of of the 15 books are competitive in WFB. Of the 2 that aren't, they still top ten - but only behind good players. This is mostly due to the fact that Fantasy doesn't revolve around a singular phase of the game.

A good player is always going to edge out. No one's saying that one game requires skill and the other doesn't. My only real point is/was that 40k is decided in the shooting phase and the armies with the strongest shooting consistently top table while the armies that can't shoot get smeared to the bottom ranks. Doesn't make one game better or worse, it was just a response to the fact that in a thread about empire rumors you decided to comment on how the magic phase turned you off to the game. I gotta stick up for WFB, it's my jam dawg! I always enjoyed it in 7th, but I was intimidated by the local player base and some of the weirder rules interactions. 8th edition fixed a lot of the things I disliked about 7th and i'd been playing 40k for 3-4 years straight without a break.

tl;dr No matter what happens, it's GW. They will find a way to make both 40k and WFB players miserable in the near future. Of this, I am certain.